In a common sence mood todayy( bad starting point already I know) and need some help please.Should probably know the answer but don't.

I am getting frustrated with HMRC(nothing new there then) about waiting for CB ref num before CTC can be put into payment as I thought it was the main responsibility test that formed eligibility and not claiming CB. I say this as you have a choice about caliming either and if you choose not to claim CB but want to claim CTC only why can't you? HMRC have advsied me that as you have an entitlment to CB it is assumed it will be claimed and is used as marker to avoid fraudulent claims. Didn't feel it was appropriate to point out to the advisor I was speaking the £40 million worth of fraudulent claims in the last tax year thus proving it must be quite easy somehow.

I pointed out that when adopters claiming for a newly placed child were not advised to claim in the child birth name they often claimed in the new adoptiove name and were paid both CB and a CTF payment for a child that they had "created" ,in the paper sense, but who did not actually/legally exist. This beacuse the child can't legally be claimed for using the adoptive name until the adoption order has been granted.

Well as you can imagine this didn't relate to my original query so I was advised to call back!! Someone please tell me the sense and help me if possible.I don't meaning with the ranting which I enjoy but with the CB waiting for CTC issue.

Thanks
Catherine

When I've encountered this problem, I've had it explained in terms of 'system problems'.

In short, as I understand it, you're quite right that a claimant should be able to claim CTC independently, or before CB, if they so choose to do so. If Tax Credits refused to pay, I'm sure that you'd win an appeal...if you ever managed to get there. Trouble is, without a CB reference 'the system' flags up a verification failure, and simply won't operate to issue payments.

There must be a back office somewhere in the Tax Credits world, competent to sort out such claims, but I suspect the advisers are probably trying to do the best for the claimant in advising to claim in a fashion which would go through with fewer problems, rather than getting lost in the realm of paper claims.

Then again, different Tax Credit advisers tell you so many different things, this could be a load of cobblers.

See that shouldn't have made me laugh but it did!

I have another interesting story developing for the "World of magic and mysticism - The HMRC way - bedtime reading for unbelievers". Will keep you posted

You're right Christine, a claim for CTC can ( and often does ) go into payment without a CHB reference.
My understanding is that there is a child benefit database called CBOL, of all the birth certificates witnessed by child benefit office. CBOL is amended if a child name change is registered by deed and they are notified.
A new CTC claim can throw up 2 child verification failures -
1) Child Not Matched, meaning the child details don't match what appears on CBOL. Can be resolved by Tax Credits adviser if a simple spelling error or DoB error when the form was scanned, or can result in TCO writing out to the claimant asking to see the birth certificate. Claimant should not send in birth certificate unsolicited.
2) Child In Current NTC Award - self explanatory really, the child appears to be being claimed for by 2 claimants. Can be resolved usually by setting effective date of new claimant to day after old claimant ended their claim, but can take ages if both claimants insist they are main carer.
There are many cases where CTC and CHB are claimed by separate parties, eg: separated couples who mutually agree one will claim CTC and the other CHB.