Paymaster General Dawn Primarolo was asked by Treasury sub-committee last week how long it is taking TCO to deal with disputed overpayment cases. She stated adamantly and repeatedly "5 weeks". This is absolutely not my experience. Are others now getting initial decisions within 5 weeks?

Christ Alive!...

absolutely not!

jj

Ahhh but did anyone ask if the 5 weeks were in the same year???

Bl**dy hell! I wish!

What a load of old baloney - i'm finding it hard to even get them to acknowledge a letter within a reasonable time.

I've never had a reply to ANYTHING within 5 weeks from the TCO.

Why are you all so surprised? Don't you know politicans live on another planet? And that a week there equals a month? or a year? or an aeon? here.

Needless to say, my experience is the same as everyone else's!

No. But if Christ were alive JJ, do you think that would make a difference, or would Her Majesticals beloved Revenue and Customs slap an overpayment on him for all those loaves and fishes!!

all those loaves and fishes? i expect customs would get in first, slap him with a penalty for smuggling, and confiscate his sandals.

either way, he's gonna be in big trouble if he doesn't register for an ID card...

: )

....and imagine his parents trying to explain the circumstances of conception if the CSA got hold of them....

Just to get things back on track, there was also an interesting nugget of information:

HMRC has also made progress in its plans to work with the voluntary sector to provide greater support to the most vulnerable claimants. I hope that the first pilot will begin in April, with experienced HMRC staff seconded into the specialist team in Citizens Advice.

Anyone know any more about this?

And it did make cynical old me laugh to read that "Tax Credit Office is making progress towards its target to deal with disputed cases within 4 weeks.

More information on IR press notice

Well yes - I suppose maybe they are "making progress". Just after reading about the 5 weeks nonsense I got an acknowledgement from them (re a disputed overpayment) which was sent only 2 weeks after the letter it was acknowledging! It used to be 2 months - if at all. Of course, their letter says they hope to be able to reply within 4 to 6 weeks. I've never known them reply in anything like the timescale they "hope to" but even if they did the minimum would be 6 weeks from complaint. Turnaround time 5 weeks Dawn?

Just to update you all, Citizens Advice Northern Ireland submitted additional evidence to the Treasury sub-committee which would indicate that there is not a 5 week average response time to overpayment disputes (basically I trawled all my TC846 submissions of the last 6 months and listed sent dates and response dates - of course one of the cases is still awaiting a response after 8 months!) Also submitted evidence of response times of Customer Services Team, who are second level of overpayment dispute process and no responses received in under 4 months! Our extra evidence also provided case evidence of inconsistencies in the application of the "reasonableness" test. So, JJ, since you seem to be the religious one amongst us, perhaps you can put a word in with the appropriate department that something good comes out of this inquiry?

With regards to the pilot working with the voluntary sector there were 3 possible working arrangements between CAB and HMRC mentioned in the submission from Citizens Advice. I'm not sure how far along discussions are, or the details of the suggested arrangements, beyond what was in the submission, because Citizens Advice Northern Ireland does not access the Citizens Advice specialist support facilities. In our extra evidence we did request that Northern Ireland be included in the consideration of any pilots.

oh dear...looks like i'm reaping the karma of blasphemy jokes...

perhaps it could be argued that it is 'unconscionable' to seek recovery of overpayments created on technicalities of claim requirements, when there has been no real loss to public funds. i would like the single/joint claim 'offsets- myth or amendment' issue cleared up.

but it looks like you're doing a grand job without divine intervention.
i'm agnostic btw, but face to face with HM Revenue, expect i'd be supersticiously attached to crosses, garlic and sharpened pointy sticks... : )

jj

and wary of false Dawns...

<sorry, couldn't resist>

It certainly isn't 5 weeks.

I can beat 8 months. I am still challenging one after 18 months. and we do not have a final decision to take an official appeal as they are still reviewing, AND we only became involved after the client has already written and received one response.

(And they have still not (a) provided a copy of the form, or (b) responded to a single one of the points we are trying to make).

However they do seem to be moving slightly faster on newer cases. We seem to be seeing some newish cases dealt with before the really old ongoing ones.

I guess I can't claim to be that disillusioned to discover politicians talk rubbish.

Victoria J

hi- I am in a complete stalemate with two clients with Tax Credit overpayments - Ive been writing to TCO since Oct 2005 and havent had one response! Quite how does anyone move on from suhc an impasse!?? Carolyne James

Involve your MP and complain complain complain!!!

At the same time use the formal complaints procedure (COP 1) until you get to the Adjudicator if it is not settled before then.

As you can see from previous postings if you have only been waiting since October 2005 for a response you are doing quite well. As well as suggestions already made of requesting intervention from MP and using complaints procedure, might I suggest involvement of the Parliamentary Ombudsman. I referred 2 cases to the Ombudsman in May 2005. I have had back the first case outcome and it cuts through all the usual waffle from the TCO and is very favourable to the client. In fact more than £4000 of overpayments were written off and £160 of compensation awarded. I know it took a long time for resolution, but the ombudsman's office sent short notes to reassure us they were still investigating the case and ultimately the outcome was good, whereas obtaining a response from the TCO can take just as long and be of no help whatsoever to the client. I am now waiting for forms from my local MP's office to refer 2 more cases to the Ombudsman's office, one of them being the case where I have been waiting 8 months for a simple reply to a letter.

Well, it is very reassuring to know that at least one aspect of the system is working as intended. Congrats on the decent result.

For more information on the Parliamentary Ombudsman, see Parliamentary and Health Service Ombudsman and click on "Make a complaint" button.

They expect you to have contacted the organisation involved to give it a chance to respond and to try to put things right.

If you are not satisfied with the answer you get, or if you do not receive an answer, you should send the complaint to your client's MP who will decide whether to pass it to the Ombudsman. They have a link available so you can identify the local MP.

Morning all!
Couldn't resist joining in on this one. The WRU in Cardiff, and moi personally - as a WRO, have nothing but negative experiences of the whole TC caboodle - basically, it's a sham, and Dawn Prima-donna clearly has failed to get any grasp of the situation.
I have a seriously disabled client - gets DLA HRMC/HRCC plus long term Incapacity, but received IB from before the crucial date so all her income is neutral. Her husband is employed in a relatively low paid occupation, so only relevant income is his wages. Both aged over 50, no children at home - all grown up and left, etc.
Since application in 2004, they have had in excess of 26 DIFFERENT calculations and revisions of award - ranging from an underpayment of £1000 to overpayments of £2000+. The original error appears to be incorrect award of over 50 premium, but they refuse to accept that their error - and the Inland Revenue accept it is THEIR error - should not be recovered. Some weeks, my client has received letters demanding repayment and cheques for under payment on same day!
Local MP has been involved, but he's a minor flunkey in the government and cares more about his promotion prospects than his constituents it appears. "False Dawn" has been written to on two occasions, but takes forever to reply and then appears to miss the point entirely. It makes me ashamed of being born in Bristol, where she hails from too.
My client has now got into debt problems, because she has budgetted on one set of figures only to find that the income varies every month, and she is worsening daily, as her condition (severe ulcerated legs) is stress related.
If anyone has a large supply of gunpowder and is prepared to deliver it to Ho. of Commons in London, I'm yer boy for lighting the fuse ... and no need to wait until November.
Rant over - feel a little better!
Splott Paul - originally Mangotsfield Paul!

If there's a subtext here of 'who's got the biggest number larger than 5 weeks' I got a call from the Adjudicator's Office today confirming that HMRC are not now going to pursue an overpayment made to a client of mine by manual payments made in May and June 2003.